Behind the Ticker: The DRGN and BOTT ETFs

Behind the Ticker offers investors a chance to get under the hood of newer or more niche ETFs. Brad Roth, Managing Partner and CIO of Thor Financial Technologies, talks strategy and the human side of investing and ETFs with the individuals bringing these funds to market. 

In this episode, Roth talks with Paul Marino, Chief Revenue Officer at Themes ETFs, to talk the two of the firm's funds, the Themes China Generative Artificial Intelligence ETF (DRGN) and the Themes Robotics & Automation ETF (BOTT). The discussion covers the relatively untapped U.S. investment well of AI development happening in China, as well as the inevitability of automation and why investors should get ahead of the curve now. 

You can also listen to this episode on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, or your preferred streaming platform. 

Bringing a Lifetime of Skills to the CRO Role 

Paul Marino brings more than 25 years of asset management experience to his role as Chief Revenue Officer at Themes ETFs, and the arc of his career is an unusually well-rounded one. He started in mutual fund wholesaling at Federated Investors, where he developed a deep appreciation for the Pittsburgh market. From wholesaling he moved into management at Pioneer Investments, building and coaching distribution teams and driving revenue at scale before the firm was eventually folded into what became Victory Capital. He tracked the industry's gravitational shift toward ETFs and when the right opportunity presented itself, he made the move.

What distinguishes Marino's background, though, is something that predates all of it. Straight out of college he worked as a journalist at Newsday, then the sixth-largest daily newspaper in the country. That early training in how to structure and communicate a message, he argues, has been just as valuable as anything he learned on a trading desk or in a sales role. As CRO, his responsibilities extend beyond distribution into marketing, business development, PR, and media — and the journalism instinct runs through all of it.

DRGN — Themes China Generative AI ETF

The thesis behind DRGN begins with a geographic reality that is easy to overlook in a U.S.-centric investment conversation: China is not only one of the most technologically sophisticated countries in the world, it has been cut off from U.S. AI infrastructure by sanctions and export controls, and is now building its own AI ecosystem from scratch. That isolation is not a deterrent in Marino's framing — it is the point. Because China cannot rely on US companies or supply chains, it has been forced to develop sovereign AI capacity across modeling, application software, infrastructure, hardware, and semiconductors. The market is large, the investment is massive, and the return stream is structurally separate from anything a US investor gets by holding domestic tech exposure.

DRGN is designed to give US investors access to that return stream through a domestic ETF trading on US exchanges. The fund holds publicly listed Chinese companies — listed on the Hong Kong exchange, the Shanghai exchange, or US exchanges — that generate the majority of their revenue from generative AI-related activities. The index is built by their index partner NBIDA and is equally weighted, rebalanced semiannually. 

Marino is direct about the risk disclosure; he does not try to paper over the complications of investing in Chinese equities. Instead he details the requirements for security inclusion and how the team also flags operational quirks, such as reduced liquidity around the Chinese New Year. For investors who are comfortable with China, DRGN offers something that broad tech ETFs — domestic or international — do not. Marino cites Jensen Huang and Lisa Su as industry voices who have publicly acknowledged the depth of Chinese AI capability, making the case that this is not a speculative bet on an emerging story but a stake in a parallel AI race that is already well underway.

BOTT — Themes Humanoid Robots ETF

The humanoid robotics conversation starts with a clarification that Marino makes early and returns to several times: BOTT is not a Tesla fund, and it is not a fund that bets on the country or company most associated with humanoid robots in the popular imagination. Tesla is in the portfolio — Optimus is part of the story — but it is not a leading position. 

The index — the Solactive Global Humanoid Robotics Index — screens for the 30 largest companies with positive total returns over the trailing 12 months that are generating revenue from factory automation, general and specialized semiconductors, industrial machine parts, and programmable logic controllers. The country weighting falls out naturally from that criteria: the US represents roughly 26% of the portfolio, with meaningful allocations to South Korea, Japan, Hong Kong/China, and a smaller position in Canada. Like DRGN, the portfolio is equally weighted and passively managed. 

Marino also pushes back on a narrow interpretation of what humanoid robotics means. The popular image — a bipedal machine walking around a factory floor — captures only part of the opportunity. BOTT's definition is broader and more practically grounded: any technology that replaces a task previously performed by a human. That definition encompasses autonomous vehicles, industrial automation, robotics used for dangerous or unpleasant labor (he cites robots cleaning public restrooms as a concrete example), and personal assistance devices. The question is not whether robots will become integrated into daily life; it's how quickly. His view is that the earlier an investor gains exposure, the more that patience will eventually pay off.

Portfolio Construction and Positioning for Advisors

Marino breaks down how both funds fit into an advisor's existing book and frames the current moment in ETF adoption as a core-and-satellite model, where broad index exposure forms the foundation and advisors are increasingly carving out thematic sleeves to capture high-conviction growth opportunities their clients are already reading and hearing about. He notes that advisors are not making these decisions in a vacuum — their clients are watching CNBC, reading WSJ, and asking why they don't have exposure to AI or robotics or gold when those themes dominate financial media. The satellite allocation is partly about returns and partly about demonstrating that the advisor is paying attention to what clients care about.

Within that sleeve, DRGN and BOTT serve different purposes. DRGN is for investors who want China AI exposure and are comfortable with the associated geopolitical and regulatory risks. BOTT is a global play on a structural technology shift that is not geographically constrained. Both are pure-play, equal-weighted, passively managed, and designed to deliver a return stream that broad-based portfolios do not currently provide.

Inside Themes ETFs: Product Development and Distribution Philosophy

The final segment of the conversation gives a useful window into how Themes operates as an organization. Marino describes a firm that is deliberately structured differently from most young ETF shops — experienced senior leadership with backgrounds at large asset managers, combined with an entrepreneurial culture that moves quickly and takes bets on niche exposures rather than competing in crowded commodity categories. 

The product development process is collaborative and ongoing. Marino himself writes a free LinkedIn newsletter called Thoughts from Themes, does regular podcast appearances, and maintains close dialogue with advisors in the field. Ideas are stress-tested informally but taken seriously, and the firm has the capital to sit with a conviction call even if initial AUM growth is slow. Marino is explicit that Themes is not building toward a short-term exit — they are building what they intend to be the next great thematic and sector-based ETF firm, and they are comfortable with the timeline that requires.

Research is also a meaningful part of the public-facing operation. The Themes website hosts a library of market commentary, individual stock analysis, and macroeconomic research — all free and available to any advisor or retail investor doing due diligence. Marino views that content infrastructure as a trust-building tool and a differentiator for a firm that is still earning its reputation in a competitive space.

Disclaimer: The market insights, projections, and investment strategies expressed in this podcast are solely those of the contributor and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of ETF.com This content is provided for informational purposes and does not constitute financial, investment, or legal advice. 

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